Differences between CEll/ Multi-CPU SystemsIt would be interesting to read what differences there are between those, both from a coder and consumer point of view. Intel is gradually introducing multi-cernel CPUs with more and more cores so aren't these becoming competing concepts?
We should stay away from points of view and qualitative speculation on Wikipedia. However.. I can say that the consumer is only interessted in CPUs that can run Windows, and Microsoft won't do that. It has nothing to do about technology and all about politics and marketing. Intel's processors and Cell isn't competing since they have totally different targets. -- Henriok 08:35, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
They may not be competing in the consumer desktop space, but they certainly are in others. The use of PC-like devices versus PS3s and set-top boxes for home media applications is one obvious example. The other one, which I am more directly familiar with, is in the high-performance computing space. I just reviewed a paper that a labmate is submitting to a conference that directly compares performance between the two, with a focus on getting the best performance of each without having to manually manage the SPE's local stores. 98.212.140.54 (talk) 06:07, 13 April 2009 (UTC)
[edit] Trusted Computing / DRMI'm extremely surprised that this article makes no mention of the Trusted Computing / DRM system built into the Cell Processor. Some people think it is a good thing and some people think it is bad, but either way it is extremely noteworthy. Just to cite a single link, IBM has a technical document on it here. IBM themselves explicitly discuss Digitial Rights Management there, which should forestall any controversy over applying the term DRM. I may try to add this to the article myself in the future, but I don't have time right now... and to be honest I know I'd have to work pretty hard to produce a suitably Neutral POV writeup. I'm not here to grind an ax, I came here LOOKING for information and was befuddled by its absence. Alsee 11:22, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
you can run AES and other encryption technolegy on the CPU, but this has nothing to do with hardcoded DRM support in the CPU itself so it's non-existent fantasia talk. Markthemac 03:08, 05 april 2007 (UTC)
I believe he is speaking of the full spectrum of overarching, interacting, hardware based security features which are actually an integral part of the workings of the entire processor. They're not really trusted computing nor are they DRM... they can be used as such, but their main design intent were as general security features to take the place of software applications (e.g. anti-virus, anti-spyware, firewall ect.). Among the most central aspects of it all is the 'Secure Processing Vault' which, put simply, allows any number of SPE's to go into a hardware based run-time isolation mode of sorts whereby any SPE is able to disengage itself from the EIB (and subsequently the entire system) during runtime. This feature allows an SPE to run its calculations almost entirely without interference from the outside world (including the operating system) e.g. making the practice of alteration of program code during runtime and in memory almost entirely non-existent.
However that isn't the only feature of the security architecture; as I stated previously there is an entire overarching intarcting spectrum of security features and protection from almost every possible angle. They all work together to form one cohesive fortress and if any one of them is beaten it is not end-game. Many of these features are so heavily integrated into the processor's workings that it makes remote hacking nearly impossible and if you did attempt to break them locally you would probably end up bricking the entire processor thus making the hardware useless for any mal-purpose. These powerful security features are the primary reason why government agencies and militaries worldwide are investing so heavily in the Cell Processor. I too am quite suprised that absolutely nothing has been made of these features here... I guess to most people this is just a regular old processor :'( and not an entire next-generation architecture which I hope will influence the direction of the industry as a whole.
Obviously, I can see how these explanations (the first especially) may present plenty of confusion and headaches since I don't have the time to more thoroughly explain it, as such you should read the full IBM white-paper on it here:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]I really do hope that someone will come along and write something about these features as they really are among the key benefits of the archetecture. There is soo much missing from this article about this and many many other things it's absurd.
These features combined with the Cell's built in networking features to be used in the planned worldwide Cell Distributed Computing Network will make for some very interesting implications... possibly allowing for intelligent threat level assessment capabilities on a worldwide scale (e.g. bricking an illegally modified or rogue device as soon as it goes online). However that part of it is all just speculation ;). There is indeed no proof anywhere in the public space of this; but you know, there are a lot of things about the full capabilities of this unique processor architecture that have yet to be publicised. All of its features are all mere side effects of our true design intent; the goal around which its entire development was based.
The future of computing lies beyond the box.
Enjoy yourselves!
(76.178.142.59 04:23, 14 October 2007 (UTC))
I created this section more than a year ago, and I am astounded that the article still makes no mention of this issue. I explicitly linked a PDF in my post to forestall an inevitable tin-foil-hat/fantasia accusation, as Markthemac made. I see that IBM has taken down the PDF that I linked, now yielding an error page. Instead I'll post a Google link that should survive any attempt to whitewash away references to the EXPLICIT DRM support designed into the Cell: "Cell Broadband Engine Support for Privacy Security and Digital Rights Management". Right there in the title of IBM's own publication, explicit statement of the Cell's explicit DRM support. I may add a DRM section to the main Cell article myself, but it's very frustrating because I am only half-familiar with the technical implementation in the Cell and I have very exacting expectations and standards on technical issues. I only half-grasp the final resultant DRM implications of the specific crypto keys that ARE in fact embedded in the chip and the various crypto mechanisms that ARE in fact embedded in the chip. I've seen these crypto keys and crypto mechanisms documented in other IBM technical papers. I'd have to do quite a bit more research on the technical design before I'd really be comfortable in my own expertise to write anything more substantial than a general explanation that the Cell carries DRM hardware with who-knows-what DRM implications. Alsee 18:59, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
As the unidentified author above your comment tried to point out, I suspect that there is a confusion of terminology. The CBEA provides for secure execution of encrypted code with hardware-enforced process isolation and hardware-supported code authentication. Here are some details IBM published in a archival, peer-reviewed journal. This should be available in a "technical library near you". It is not at all hidden. (Various articles in vol 51, no 5 of the IBM JR&D
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] discuss these features. The Shimizu, Hoffstee, Liberty article gives the most details.) In less-technical language, this allows programmers to be sure that their programs cannot be tampered with. If these programs manage encrypted data, then this data cannot be tampered with (if the programs are designed properly, of course).
This, however, is not Digital Rights Management, per se, which is probably Markthemac's point. These features could be used to create a digital rights management system if that were desired. The historic business model for a games console involves selling hardware at a loss (and many web sites have done teardowns and analyses of the PS/3 which suggest that the console is sold at a loss) and making up for that loss with sales of software. In order to support this business model, Sony (and Microsoft & Nintendo as well) must have absolute control over the software market so that the flow of royalties is guaranteed. Also, having uncontrolled software could interfere with various "family friendly" and ESRB-related features of the console, but this is speculation on my part.
In fact, in Microsoft's case (a bit off-topic for this article) their spokesman, Major Nelson, has said explicitly that the strict control Microsoft has over the software (IIIRC he even said DRM) is what enables them to get content providers to agree to their video marketplace....they can be assured that only Microsoft's software can access those files and that said software will enforce the terms of the contract Microsoft signed.
Anyway, certainly the CBEA security features should be part of any complete discussion of the Cell processor. Using the term, DRM, would probably be unnecessarily inflammatory. Perhaps the link I provide above would enable someone to write such a section. --Philhower (talk) 22:30, 18 December 2007 (UTC) (as an IBM employee who played a small part in the Cell processor implementation, I believe that directly editing the article may violate my terms of employment)
"Using the term, DRM, would probably be unnecessarily inflammatory." As I cited, it was IBM itself that applied the term DRM. You are accusing IBM itself being "unnecessarily inflammatory" about their own product. As far as the wikipedia page using the term DRM, it cannot possibly be wikipedia-inflammatory to accurately repeat a term in the article which was applied by the very producer of the product. Alsee (talk) 08:25, 31 December 2007 (UTC)
What DRM are you talking about, application DRM or media based DRM (i.e. music DRM)? If you mean DRM in general, then NO! Because the PS3 can rip DRM based Itunes music files to its HDD. DRM ripping software for the PC is rare, but the PS3 can rip the files perfectly out of the box (not considering that it renames your music files) If you would like to know more please visit the discussion section of the PlayStation 3 on Wiki, I have a discussion going on that topic. DevonTheDude (talk) 01:23, 4 March 2008 (UTC)
DevonTheDude, this is about very technical points of the hardware innards of the Cell relating to DRM. This is (mostly) unconnected to whether or not the SP3 can rip iTunes files. The point here is that the cell has hardware features designed to prevent "unauthorized" DRM reading software, and when you *are* able to play DRM files to more throughly lock your files against you and lock them into the approved DRM software. Alsee (talk) 03:18, 28 March 2008 (UTC)